My Guide on Geomancer

[Sooty]

I know that most of our locals think that Geomancer is utter crap. I disagree and here's a link to my guide at the official forums with replays at the bottom.

*Shameless advertising*

Click Here (http://forums.dota-allstars.com/index.php?showtopic=113499)

And for those who actually bothered to look and try it out, do tell me if you manage to succeed with it =)

[d0minic]

Not bad. very detailed guide indeed. didnt know how poof works until you list it out the steps

[xianzai92]

=.= i cant log in ...

[xianzai92]

..........................................

[BaByWizZieE]

lol spammer
zzz

[BaByWizZieE]

Skill Build
1 - Stats (Possibly going one point of Earthbind here instead of at level 8/9)
2 - Poof
3 - Stats
4 - Poof
5 - Poof
6 - Divided We Stand
7 - Poof
8 to 9 - Geostrike and Earthbind (Geostrike may be replaced by a point of stats instead, see below)
10 - Stats
11 - Divided We Stand
12 to 15 - Geostrike and Earthbind or Stats (Typically I max geostrike regardless)
16 - Divided We Stand
17 to 25 - Geostrike and Earthbind or Stats

Final Item Build, in order of importance.
Power Threads
Lothar's Edge
Mekansm
Desolator
Necromicron
Vladamir's

Item build broken down
Ror + 2x GG branches starting
Ring of Basilius (Only if it helps someone in your lane, otherwise, skip until later)
Power Threads (If your team is in some peril by mid game, complete Lothar's first to help fight)
Lothar's Edge
Mekansm
The Rest as abovementioned

Core strategy and goals
Levels 1 to 5 - Gain xp to hit level 6, lane carefully to hit target asap
Levels 6 to 10 - Gain xp to hit level 11, use first clone to gain even more xp
Levels 11 to 15 - Start farming like crazy. Upon lothars, start hunting.
Level 16 to 18 - Should still be midgame for other heroes. Go crazy.
Level 19 to 24 - Try to abuse your opponents before you stop getting anymore xp.
Level 25 - Start pushing immediately if you have not to keep your advantage up.


Rundown on gameplay
Micromanagement
Meepo is very micro-intensive, at least the way I play him, but I don't believe there is much of an art to playing him as compared to say pudge. To be succesful with him you must be very familiar with the technical aspects of his gameplay.

I suggest hotkey his 4 bodies to 1, 2, 3, 4, especially if your Function Keys are far away from your alphabets which are important for using skills. If you are comfortable with using F1-4 for controlling individual Meepos, you can hotkey all four to Ctrl-1, because when using continuous earthbind and mass poof, it is easier to press tab to switch between multiple meepos, rather than pressing four different keys to control them.

Paying attention to the top left corner of your screen to see the conditions of the various clones as well as whether they're being attacked or not is very important. Learn to identify the one being targetted by looking at the top left, not by trying to pick out the right guy out of the thick of the battle.


Conservative gameplay until you hit level 6, focus on getting to level 11
Start out with an ror + 2gg branches.
Avoid getting harassed. Farm if you can, but do it safely. Your last hit will need to be pretty good because he has low base damage and is melee. You can go to any lane, they each have their advantages.

Meepo has nothing much to offer until he gets to level 11. The whole point of the geomancer is to ride on the wave of multipled experience in order to overwhelm your opponents. Once you have three bodies, the amount of experience you gain will be phenomenal and you will be able to farm so quickly that no one else can possibly catch up.

Poof
Follow the skill build, max poof at level 7 and get your ultimate at level 6. It gets cheaper to use once it hits level 4, so don't bother using levels 1 and 2 of the skill.

It is possible to surprise your enemy with poof, because it does decent damage if you can catch your opponent unaware. Having an lane partner with a disable could mean poof could act as a proper nuke.

The main reason for getting Poof at level 7 because it is a very strong farming skill when geomancers cast it on themselves. 320 damage will instantly kill ranged creeps in the early game, it will be easy to get 3 opposition creep kills from one wave by Poofing properly. Against large masses, quickly harvest them with Poof before the chance is lost. Mostly though, you will be using poof to as an opening against a group of neutral creep spawns.

Poof is a lot of damage, and is the basis of this entire idea of using Geomancer. Mostly I use only half the damage when hunting (lothars, as you will read later), but in huge fights with disables flying all around and everyone all messy, 4xpoof from and to a single area has the same effect as a huge sonic wave. This will mostly happen in base defence or pushing, hardly in normal encounters.

Neutral Creeps

SmallCreeps
5xKobolds
3xWolves
3xTrolls
Kobold+2xTrolls
3xGnolls
These five groups are the ones you can immediately handle without problem using level 4 poof. Go for these for the easy gold. You can use bodies with low health but enough mana, just make sure you don't die.

2xGolem
These cannot be poofed. Send a body with health but no mana (or poof still cooling down) to tackle them. To speed up the process with these hitting with two bodies should be considered.

2xCentaur
3xSatyrs
With level 4 poof, killing the smaller centaur and the two smaller satyrs is no problem. Just back away from the big one and come back for it later if there is nothing smaller to creep. Centaur stuns groups of 3 or more.

2xFurlbog
3xOgres
These two groups are tough, but are easily taken out with two bodies and double poof.
You should never waste time with the Ogres if they're frosted. Kill the magi and back off, hunt the other two only after frost shield has exhausted.
Furlbogs stun groups of three or more.

BigCreeps
You shouldn't be walking past them in big groups for most part. You should only try them if you have at least 3 bodies. They're viable if you're using three bodies to farm three different neutral camps, then they can all gather and hunt the big ones.

3xDragonspawn
Easy with a triple poof. They do too much damage and evade too often otherwise. Not before level 11.

3xGolems
Not very easy. You need a good amount of health to tackle them. But sometimes you really need to clear them to make way for other big creeps.

3xDragons
Surprisingly easy because the two small dragons can be killed with help from at least 2 poofs. They are worth so much they're really a good hunt, even before level 11.

[BaByWizZieE]

thats more on the web..and seriously its too much =.= ...

im lazy to copy down all

[Gee]

-_- i see how you placed your skill build dunwan to see liao, obviously the author doesnt know much about meepo and his skills, anyhow pump -_-

[BaByWizZieE]

lols. addin of attribute first is big mistake as well..

[xianzai92]

Nope. I feel dat adding stats will help more. Meepo's skills r more of a one-sided type . Dats gd. HOWEVER, his starting life and ez to be killed clones can get him to die fast without him noticing . Derefore, stats will be a gd choice to improve his life by abit and dmg cos he nids it in order to farm. Juz my 2 cents .

[Gee]

-_- sian.....im not saying the stats part is wrong, but the whole poofing part is wrong. His strat uses poofing to farm neutral....if opponent any decent, he catch u farming neutral and u just poofed in, then how u plan to escape.
2nd, he did not pump geostrike lvl 1 at all until quite high lvl, which just shows he has no knowledge of meepo, geostrike actually procs every time u hit for 15 dmg and another 15 dmg 1 sec later, so it just means that u just added +15 dmg to ur hero wif 1 stats. I lazy to explain more le ...u all go figure out bah -_-

[King4hao]

commented on DA forum.

I personally felt that your build is more of theory craft .
You mentioned that high teamwork is needed.While you are farming,rest of team will be supporting you in a way or so.
Yet,geomancer is no way a league hero. and i doubt there much teamwork in public anyway.
This make geomancer alot more fragile than most hero,especially with it low life.

[birdie]

I was thinking, does meepo get exp from both its images and self while in different places creeping? This seems to imply it can level up very fast with its images.

Geostrike can help the hero to farm more easily, and the skill stacks with other images.

[Sooty]

Wah very mean leh, all theorycraft haha. If it's all theorycraft then how do I manage to do so well with him?

Also Gee, I guess you are right about a quick point in geostrike rather than waiting until you start neutralling, because it helps a LITTLE bit in laning and getting last hit there also. But of course stats will still be better regardless if you completely cannot farm if the opponent are very strong harassers.

And the thing about poofing in to neutral, now i can say you're the one who doesn't know anything about Meepo. You don't poof IN to neutral something, you poof on yourself to inflict 360 damage to all the neutral creeps. I pose a very simple question, what is more dangerous

1) Do 360 damage to all creeps, quickly kill them and running off
2) Slowly whack those creeps and when opponent comes try to escape with poof.

So you're right about geostrike but completely wrong about poof. Farming faster is everything Meepo is about. You have no idea what meepo is about. :/

[d0minic]

TO U GUYS OUT THERE. stop ****ing comment and say his meepo suck. why not take a look at his replays and u will be enlightened. i at first thought why not go bind and geostrike. if u didnt noe how to use poof . just go see his replay. especially replay 5. then comment. zzzzzz

[d0minic]

-_- sian.....im not saying the stats part is wrong, but the whole poofing part is wrong. His strat uses poofing to farm neutral....if opponent any decent, he catch u farming neutral and u just poofed in, then how u plan to escape.
2nd, he did not pump geostrike lvl 1 at all until quite high lvl, which just shows he has no knowledge of meepo, geostrike actually procs every time u hit for 15 dmg and another 15 dmg 1 sec later, so it just means that u just added +15 dmg to ur hero wif 1 stats. I lazy to explain more le ...u all go figure out bah -_-


what a ****ing noob. he dun poof into a neutral creep and ppl catch u there. he send his images to the neutral creep. and he poof himself ? did u noe that the poof thingy can poof and click itself ?

[quincyzzx]

o.0.....i wont even learn clone....siao if opponent got viper or killer hero u gg...lol

[King4hao]

If you don't have ulti,you level slower..but less risk of dieing.
So basically,no pay no gain.

Instead,you should learn it if you can micro well.
Ward up and farm.When enemy spotted,immediately get out.

[Sooty]

!!! Totally unfounded. If your opponent has viper the moment he appears to be aggroing you you can escape away furion style. Doesn't everyone get scroll of TP against viper in the first place? Meepo has built in TP!

Only sheer DPS can kill Meepo before he kills you, if you add in poof damage, because it's basically a sonic wave. Viper's ulti is damage over time, so he will have a harder time dealing with Meepo than other heroes, in fact. I wish I could prove it to you... but if you refuse to let yourself believe that it is even possible in the first place I really can't do anything. Really, just go watch the last replay to see then MAYBE you can say misunderstood him a LITTLE.

Sian I feel so whiny already. It's really damn hard to prove anything lar. Quincy you obviously totally condemn this guy liao -.-

[quincyzzx]

i ss yr clone hit a few tym u die wif all of them ....*evil laughter*

[Gee]

what a ****ing noob. he dun poof into a neutral creep and ppl catch u there. he send his images to the neutral creep. and he poof himself ? did u noe that the poof thingy can poof and click itself ?

You obviously didnt know what i was trying to say in the 1st place. Might i add on that poof has a cooldown 30 secs, u wait until u lvl 11 then u start farming. Yes u can poof in wif real one and tp to escape if u want, but might i add that poof is a 2 sec cast time spell compared to 3 sec for tp. Additionally, u buy tp need 1 slot in which case if u use tp for poofing u dont. Likedat you kill 1 creep spawn every 30 secs wow congrats man..i prolly can kill the creep faster when i even reach lvl 11, btw u dun need 11 to start hunting if u even bothered to get 1-4 lvls of net , lvl 1 poof , lvl 1 geostrike ulti and rest all stats. That trick of yours only works on pub or

So now your a bloody pro since u said im a noob. You come use that so called awesome method of meepo and play draft kthx

[d0minic]

see his replays. i wont say much

[Sooty]

You obviously didnt know what i was trying to say in the 1st place.

I also have no idea what you're trying to say in your last post. What is the rest of your post about?

Might i add on that poof has a cooldown 30 secs, u wait until u lvl 11 then u start farming.
Are you saying YOU wait, or I wait? I certainly didn't ask anyone to wait until level 11 to farming. So if you're saying that YOU wait until level 11 to start farming, then... I don't know why you are even talking about knowing how to play Meepo.The first part of the sentence has completely nothing to do with the second part of the second too.

Yes u can poof in wif real one and tp to escape if u want, but might i add that poof is a 2 sec cast time spell compared to 3 sec for tp. Additionally, u buy tp need 1 slot in which case if u use tp for poofing u dont.
What the **** is 'poof in with the real one' and then 'tp to escape'??? Only the real one can hold a scroll of TP. You poof in with the real one already then you TP out!? If you are saying that you need some sort of TP or poof to survive neutral creeping, then I already told you, I use poof to make creeping so hasty it's safer to kill and run rather than slowly whack and hope to TP away if anyone comes.

Likedat you kill 1 creep spawn every 30 secs wow congrats man..i prolly can kill the creep faster when i even reach lvl 11
Again you don't sound like you're thinking through what you're saying. I creep one spawn in less than 5 seconds every 30 seconds, which essentially gives me 25 seconds to walk around to search for another decent camp to poof, or actually hit something easy like gnolls on scourge side. But I certainly am not limited to creeping one creep spawn every 30 seconds.

btw u dun need 11 to start hunting if u even bothered to get 1-4 lvls of net , lvl 1 poof , lvl 1 geostrike ulti and rest all stats. That trick of yours only works on pub or
If you imagined that Meepo had a carrion swarm instead of poof, it'd be exactly what I'm doing with it, using the 'carrion swarm' to farm. The whole point of Geomancer is obviously getting additional xp, in which 'farming' is a side product of, which is why I do not hunt before level 11, because it simply is NOT efficient. I do not have a kill solution that kills regardless of position (doom, veno), nor do I have good movement speed to be an 'everywhere hunter' (nightstalker, bloodseeker). I balance efficiency with risk with my style. All you sound like you want to do is to debunk everything that I put forward, which isn't helpful to anyone at all, except to stoke your ego.

Without even proving that your way of playing is draft-worthy, you challenge us to a draft that uses Meepo. Ya, and now that you know the opposition going to play Meepo you're going to pick Zeus and all, because it's just so damn smart. I hope one day the metagame will turn in such a way that when you play a competition with your team, the opposition surprises you by picking Meepo as their last pick and proceeding to own in some manner. Because this time, you wouldn't have thought of putting Zeus in the line up.

You really want to challenge? You pick a hero on the opposite team, they pick one on yours too. And it's going to be something janky like Alchemist.

(Shakes head)
Ridiculous, want to handicap the opposite team by picking a hero for them before the game even begin.

[d0minic]

Good job dude.

[mysterialite]

Well it'd help to keep your feet on the ground. You're gonna miss out on alot of vision if you're gonna look down with your nose hanging in the air.

So how many of you comdemned his guide after watching the replay?

Or rather, how many of you flamers actually watched any of the replays?

And if you did, please come up with a better guide since you're making this one to seem so flawed.

[quincyzzx]

Well it'd help to keep your feet on the ground. You're gonna miss out on alot of vision if you're gonna look down with your nose hanging in the air.

So how many of you comdemned his guide after watching the replay?

Or rather, how many of you flamers actually watched any of the replays?

And if you did, please come up with a better guide since you're making this one to seem so flawed.
all the guide all gone liao after reset.....

[tantk]

geomancer just a farming hero i would say >.< , but i think see situation first ba, i think geomancer have alot of different way to play.
depends on ur teammates, for instance u have one doctor on ur lane u might want earthbind and clone, then can earthbind twice! XD

[SuZuKa]

So I decided not to be a bastard and watch yr replay b4 commenting.....
After watching the replay tat was recommended(meepo4), i was really disappointed....

The only thing u have proven is that geomancer is an excellent farmer after lvl 6. He is still a useless hero in early game with no lane control and farming capabilities. Even though u can farm like mad after lvl 6, there isnt much items that is good on him so after u max yr items, all yr money goes into reviving yr hero from the tavern and pumping the 2 other heros which isnt allowed in the first place... At lvl 25, yr clones are only ard 1400 hp i think and dies super easily to focus fire... we are not even talking abt a normal 5v5 game with mass nukes and aoe, the clones simply die to focus fire from 1 agi hero. Also becos of his clones, he can levels extremely fast which becomes a bad thing when he dies. Neutral creeping is oso very common (although not in yr replay) and the chances of yr clones getting caught creeping while u r looking elsewhere is very big too..

So my conclusion is geomancer is only ok in pubs.

[Gee]

Lol, so your saying that zeus bloody pwns your tatic. Tell you what, nearl 100% of drafts will either have qop / zeus / thd on either side, so your saying as long as one of such aoe gets picked u cant play your style anymore? then might as well dont play cause it will never happen, i dont even need know u are using meepo to draft at least 1 of such AoE heroes to kill you. Btw, note that the way you play u dunt even learn net till rather late, and from the style you play ur hero is entirely useless by end game. So why bother

[Sooty]

yaya put words in my mouth all u want dun use him lor, why bother posting in this thread noob i think if u see opp with qop/zeus/thd then u also quit bah cause you can't play meepo and u anyhow net people think u can kill them oh ya and i challenge u to meepo my meepo 1v5 your entire team i make sure i net you at level 1 noob lol, so btw you are saying u dun even dare to play meepo... ok, then i dun bother telling u how to play, u go play your own game anyhow draft bet your team get pwnt haha surely get pwnt 100% of drafts cause they will always pick qop /zeus/thd

^^^ Above is the kinda shit you spewing.


Is this guy a complete retard or what. Zeus is NOT an AOE hero. AOE is AREA OF EFFECT. Zeus is targeted. His ulti, which is what Meepo is afraid of, is not AOE, it targets every single hero. Only his static field actually has an AOE anywhere in the description, and apparently Meepo has such low HP it really doesn't hurt that much also. And I didn't say AOE heroes own Meepo.

In fact I think Meepo could be great against QOP and THD. And ya, 100% of drafts will have either qop/zeus/thd, but the one who pick the zeus can be the team using Meepo. And it's not 'my style' that gets owned by Zeus, it's Meepo that gets owned by Zeus, and you just got owned on so many different levels.

[Gee]

Ok whatever you say, i shall let you continue to deceive yourself in your state of extreme delusion. your degree of insolence which has allowed you to decept yourself in thinking your the only right one has far surpassed the majority. So i shall ease you of your desperation to seek attention by saying your meepo so pro that no one in the world can win you, and that only the style you play is correct. Regardless of your impudence and nescience, i shall forgive you for your pitiful condition of being just another minor who thinks too highly of himself. Since you had so much difficulty deciphering what i meant in my earlier posts, since you were merely rebutting the way i had used my language instead of the arguments i have made, i have now formally written a reply just for you so that you can begin to comprehand what i meant. I just hope this labyrinthine remark is good enough for your demanding standards and look forward to seeing some sesquipedalian replies to match your intelligence

[Sooty]

Nope. I am not deceiving myself. I never ever thought for one second that my way of playing surpassed the majority. From the very start I had explained that the only thing I was trying to do was to prove that Meepo was not useless.

You never at one moment in this thread critically considered and presented what you thought. You merely waved a hand and dismissed everything. I more than called your shit by pointing out where your arguments had gone in both areas of language and facts. For example, in the post which I quoted you multiple times, every single point mentioned how incomprehensive your sentence was, also attempted to determine exactly what you were trying to say and rebutt accordingly. I obviously had no problem deciphering your previous post about Zeus, which I pointed out that you had made a factual error and you had clearly put words into my mouth, because I never once mentioned the term 'AoE' in my post you replied to.

Of course, you can label my attitudes as 'impudence and nescience' and regard me as 'pitiful' all you want. I called you a retard and I felt good although you obviously aren't.

So was that your bottom line? Now here's mine.
I posted a guide because I thought the hero was maligned. It was a rushed guide and it was my first guide. My primary concern had been to let people that Meepo was not simply fodder, but even I myself was not sure if I had achieved that. People still believed that he would be owned like hell before anything could ever be achieved, regardless of what anyone said. The reason this is so is because I never did truly analyse the hero theoretically to debunk them. I merely showed that the apparent risk and vulnerability that came with Meepo also came with huge rewards, and the guide favoured the simplest method of engagement - via lothars edge.

By now, I am adept enough in the hero to say the only part that would constitute a 'unique playstyle' on my part is the conscious use of poof, which from the very beginning I had believed was the key to Meepo in every single way possible. This belief has not changed.

You seem to be saying I have a certain playstyle, a very narrow one. In fact I do. That playstyle is maxing poof by level 7. However, the rest of my choices have become fluid. Apart from altering the build I plan to reccommend to <geostrike earthbind poof poof poof ulti poof> resulting in NO points of stats at all for 7 levels, I thoroughly know that there can be huge variation, such as in matchups where you do not need geostrike due to being harassed to badly you can't counter attack or use clones for neutral creeping. But as I say again, my reliance on Poof has never changed.

I can see that your idea of playing Meepo simply used less Poof, farm xp and gold less and hunt more, but believe me, when it comes down to engaging enemy heroes, survival and other situations, we would probably be playing Meepo in the exactly same way. You have merely chosen to take another path that everyone knew was possible from the start. Neither of us are blind. We have just different ideas of how effective each direction is.

If I had appeared to discredit your choice direction, I apologize and I now clarify - if your style makes Meepo competitive in serious games (as opposed to competitive draft games which are obviously a little too high for Meepo to be currently considered because the hero IS a little underwhelming as of now), I would gladly promote it the aggressive style of play over my conservative one now.

Everyone, Gee is not wrong. It's just that all of us, including the both of me and Gee, have been blinded by the need to defend ourselves we simply refuse to think clearheadedly what exactly the argument was about. Meepo's multiple bodies obviously farm neutrals very well, but I had forgotten to even mention that with copies on the lose (while you still get xp from your main lane), ganging and hunting becomes a distinct possibility. So Gee, I thank you for reminding us that Meepo can be played very aggressively from start to finish.

[xabo]

dun think meepo clones can be use in a draft match unless very early game maybe only for farming or like free boots of travel??

[Reya]

this thread alot of word.. lazy to see. lalal ~

[xArcHx]

nice guide,appreciated it,gonna try it out,haha ty

[StripperA]

debate siao sia, join competition can win..future professors..singapore future bright like the sun~

[MR.A-Z]

wao.. flaming.. teasing.. boosting... all over the place.. but so glad both Gee n Sooty calm down at the end .. humbly admit n learn to tolerate with each others strength n weakness.. Tht's cool~^^
No guide in this world is 100% applicable n ownage in each games.. i believe u all know well of this fact.So pls dun pull down others who try to share their happiness of new found guide. It is ownage in some situation..some matches.. its great to share with some ppl tht didn't notice it.. some ppl tht bored of get pawned of usin meepo or get bored of the same old style of meepo tht unstopable.. it is a new creative guide tht make me thinkin of usin meepo again.. though i'm the 1 tht bored of using the same old style to bully others.
Thx for Sooty tht contribute the creative idea.. thx for Gee tht take time give advise n suggestion. But pls do it with a mild way. Dota is channel to make fren not enemy. Love u all .. muacks^^

[StripperA]

yeah the usual:make love not war..